RE: NANFA-L-- Niagara River gobies?

Crail, Todd (tcrail-in-UTNet.UToledo.Edu)
Sat, 2 Apr 2005 18:43:27 -0500

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I'll second Patrick's comments. If it's legal to transport them from =
where you're capturing them (which in most states it's not) you're going =
to want to keep them in their own system. Their invasiveness seems to =
stem from multiple broods per year and a very aggressive behavior that =
outright displaces other species. Logperch, for example, seem to be =
figuring out a niche inbetween the invaders, and have been on the return =
the last two years... Greenside and johnny darters are just plain gone. =
But I think even in a tank, the only thing you'd really want to pair up =
with them are larger sunfish. They really are that mean.
=20
That's very interesting that you're catching 5" specimens over that way. =
The folks here-in-the Lake Erie Center (which I work with) haven't seen =
any near shore specimens over 4" in Lake Erie for a while now both in =
seine hauls, trawls, etc. But the Lake Ontario phenotype could be =
totally different, and I've got some people who'd wanna compare some =
DNA. There's a few different hypothesis floating about the invasion =
size compared to the size down the road a dozen generations. They get =
9-10" in their native waters (which is scary :) and enjoy far larger =
individual territories, leaving space for other species, and we're not =
seeing that here-in-all. They seem to be carpeting the bottom-in-=
whatever body size they all balance out-in-amongst themselves.
=20
However, those of you in the Lake St. Clair area... We've got another =
introduction from the Global Neogobius Tour, the tubenose goby, =
Proterorhinus marmoratus. They're real sweethearts of a fish, are cool =
as heck and pretty much mind their own (and I don't think they're =
regulated yet). I haven't been up to see the field sites yet (I guess =
the lower Clinton River has a healthy population) but they seem to be =
filling an empty niche and are keeping relatively quiet along the =
invasion front (believed to have been introduced with the round goby, =
but have pretty much stayed local). From what I understand, they live =
in the most dag nasty detritus accumulations. Find the loose sticks and =
leaves that "bubble when you walk", and there too shall you find the =
tubenose :)
=20
Todd
The Muddy Maumee Madness, Toledo, OH
It's never too late to have a happy childhood.
http://www.farmertodd.com

________________________________

From: owner-nanfa-l-in-nanfa.org on behalf of patrick herbert

i live in the buffalo niagra river, these round nose gobies Neogobius =
melanostomus are a nasty invasive species. They are pretty much found =
everywhere. They are replacing the native species of scupins. They look =
similar, but have a dark spot on hte rear of the first dorsal fin. They =
are a benthic fish and will feed on pretty much anything ,darters lake =
trout eggs. the only good thing i can say about them is that they are =
known to eat zebra mussels.i have kept some in a tank but they will eat =
your other fish. they are a tough little fish and will life in deep low =
oxygen waters. and i can't recall anyother fish activly feeding on them. =
They spawn in early spring to late summer with high fucundity rates. =
sincerly patrick herbert SUNY Brockport=20

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<BODY>=0A=
<DIV id=3DidOWAReplyText86606 dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I'll second =
Patrick's =0A=
comments.&nbsp; If it's <STRONG>legal</STRONG> to transport them from =
where =0A=
you're capturing them (which in most states it's not) you're going to =
want to =0A=
keep them in their own system.&nbsp; Their invasiveness seems to stem =
from =0A=
multiple broods per year and a very aggressive behavior that outright =
displaces =0A=
other species.&nbsp; Logperch, for example, seem to be figuring out a =
niche =0A=
inbetween the invaders, and have been on the return the last two =
years... =0A=
Greenside and johnny darters are just plain gone.&nbsp; But I think even =
in a =0A=
tank, the only thing you'd really want to pair up with them are larger =0A=
sunfish.&nbsp; They really <STRONG>are</STRONG> that mean.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>That's very interesting that =
you're =0A=
catching 5" specimens over that way.&nbsp; The folks here-in-the Lake =
Erie =0A=
Center (which I work with) haven't seen any near shore specimens over 4" =
in Lake =0A=
Erie for a while now both in seine hauls, trawls, etc.&nbsp;&nbsp;But =
the Lake =0A=
Ontario phenotype could be totally different, and I've got some people =
who'd =0A=
wanna compare some DNA.&nbsp; There's a few different hypothesis =
floating about =0A=
the invasion size compared to the size down the road a dozen =
generations.&nbsp; =0A=
They get 9-10" in their native waters (which is scary :) and enjoy far =
larger =0A=
individual territories, leaving space for other species, and we're not =
seeing =0A=
that here-in-all.&nbsp; They seem to be carpeting the bottom-in-whatever =
body =0A=
size they all balance out-in-amongst themselves.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>However, those of you in the =
Lake St. Clair =0A=
area...&nbsp; We've got another introduction from the <EM>Global =
Neogobius =0A=
Tour</EM>, the tubenose goby, <EM>Proterorhinus =0A=
marmoratus.&nbsp;&nbsp;</EM>They're<EM> </EM>real sweethearts of a fish, =
are =0A=
cool as heck&nbsp;and pretty much mind their own (and I don't think =
they're =0A=
regulated yet).&nbsp; I haven't been up to see the field sites yet (I =
guess the =0A=
lower Clinton River has a healthy population) but they seem to be =
filling an =0A=
empty niche and are keeping relatively quiet along the invasion front =
(believed =0A=
to have been introduced with the round goby, but have pretty much stayed =0A=
local).&nbsp; From what I understand, they live in the most dag nasty =
detritus =0A=
accumulations.&nbsp; Find the loose sticks and leaves that "bubble when =
you =0A=
walk", and there too shall you find the tubenose&nbsp; :)</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Todd</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The Muddy Maumee Madness, =
Toledo, =0A=
OH</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>It's never too late to have a =
happy =0A=
childhood.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><A =0A=
href=3D"http://www.farmertodd.com">http://www.farmertodd.com</A></FONT></=
DIV></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><BR>=0A=
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A=
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> owner-nanfa-l-in-nanfa.org on =
behalf of =0A=
patrick herbert<BR></FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV>=0A=
<DIV>i live in the buffalo niagra river, these round nose gobies =
Neogobius =0A=
melanostomus are a nasty invasive species. They are pretty much found =0A=
everywhere. They are replacing the native species of scupins. They look =
similar, =0A=
but have a dark spot on hte rear of the first dorsal fin. They are a =
benthic =0A=
fish and will feed on pretty much anything ,darters lake trout eggs. the =
only =0A=
good thing i can say about them is that they are known to eat zebra =
mussels.i =0A=
have kept some in a tank but they will eat your other fish. they are a =
tough =0A=
little fish and will life in deep low oxygen waters. and i can't recall =
anyother =0A=
fish activly feeding on them. They spawn in early spring to late summer =
with =0A=
high fucundity rates. sincerly patrick herbert SUNY Brockport =0A=
<BR></DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>=0A=

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