Re: NANFA-L-- Mud sunfish Sacramento Perch. now Elassoma (long)

Michael Sandel (kwksand-in-yahoo.com)
Tue, 7 Mar 2006 14:07:22 -0800 (PST)

Yup.

Bob Bock <bockhouse-in-earthlink.net> wrote: Michael, would it be correct to paraphrase what you just said as:

"the jury is still out whether or not pygmy sunfish are really members of the sunfish family." Although they are similar to sunfish in some respects, they also bear similarities to sticklebacks and mullets. Research is ongoing to properly classify these fishes and determine their closest relatives."

-----Original Message-----
>From: Michael Sandel
>Sent: Mar 7, 2006 10:49 AM
>To: nanfa-l-in-nanfa.org
>Subject: Re: NANFA-L-- Mud sunfish Sacramento Perch. now Elassoma (long)
>
>Right on, Joe. This hypothesis was published in 1993, by some reknowned ichthyologists (Johnson and Patterson). They based the relationship on skeletal characters, primarily dealing with the vertebral column. The SMEGMAmorpha is named for the acronym, which is made from the first letter of each group contained within.
>
> S = Synbranchidae: the swamp eels, yeah, the FL invasives.
> M = Mastacembelids: the spiny eels, common in petshops.
> E = Elassomatidae: pygmies.
> G = Gasterosteidae: sticklebacks, (and relatives).
> M = Mugiliformes: mullets etc.
> A = Atheriniformes: killifishes, silversides, flying fishes...
>
> The validity of this group has been contested (which might not surprise some of you), based on other morphological characters. I have not yet seen a molecular (DNA) phylogeny that decisively answers the question. Interestingly, a group of systematists from Japan have left Elassoma out of their most recent mitogenomic phylogeny. They took the entire mitochondrial DNA sequence (>15,000 A's, T's, G's, and C's) from over 100 species, to find out who's related to who. Well, turns out the pygmies complicate the family tree too much, so the question is unanswered (Miya et al. 2006). Part of my work-in-UA will look-in-Smegmamorpha, but focus on the relationship between pygmies and sticklebacks. Dr. Johnson, who works-in-the Smithsonian, appreciates the behavioral similarity of pygmy sunfish and sticklebacks, which was recently recalled in the E. zonatum article in American Currents (Echelle and Echelle 2005).
>
> For years, folks considered pygmies to be "weird" centrarchids. Few people doubted the relationship, since both groups are endemic to North America, and are most diverse in the southeastern US. Some thought they were neotenic (reproductively mature in juvenile form) sunfishes. Jordan thought they were cichlids... Now they're miniature dancing swamp mullets.
>
>
> Here's a blurb from the ASIH Meeting Minutes (1997), that shows how much fun ichthyolgists have had with pygmies.
>
> WHEREAS David Starr Jordan, George Boulenger, Albert Gunther, C. Tate Regan, Thomas Eaton, Leo S. Berg, P. Humphrey Greenwood, George Myers, Stanley Weitzman, Donn Rosen, Joe Nelson, Joe Jones, Joe Quatro, John Bruner, Dick Robins annnnd Reeve M. Bailey all hold a heartfelt conviction that Elassoma is a "pygmy sunfish", and
>
>
> WHEREAS G. David Johnson and Victor G. Springer have clearly and eloquently demonstrated that Elassoma is nothing more than an ontogenetically challenged stickleback,
>
> THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that from this day forth, sticklebacks be referred to as "naked giant pygmy sunfishes".
>
> Mike
>
>"Joseph S." wrote:
> I read somewhere that pygmy sunfish were supposedly close to
>sticklebacks and then read that they may be placed in a new order
>Smegmaformes or something like that,
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